Closing access ????

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Ryan said:
@TightLine you have posted several times that it is "selfish" to not obey the "stay at home" order.

Here is the way I look at it. The government at this point in time is asking 100% of the population to shut down their lives in an attempt to protect what, somewhere between 1% - 3% of the population that is truly at risk of a terrible outcome. And in doing this, has caused somewhere in the neighborhood of 33% unemployment (and growing), a rate that is higher than we had during the Great Depression, and throwing the WORLD into a recession, with the very real threat of it becoming a full blown depression. As opposed to the 1% - 3% of the population COVID has dire consequences for (heck, double that % if it makes you feel better), we as a society are willing to put the vast majority of the world population at immense financial risk.

Access to Lake Powell is small potatoes. The real risk is what is happening to the economy, as well our civil liberties. At some point we have to be able to get back to some semblance of a normal life.

Either way, tell me which side is being "selfish" here?
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Well said Ryan. I hope we see ”normal” again in my lifetime.
 
I guess we really do live in a zoo...with the zookeepers wanting the same vacation that the other non-essentials are getting? lol. They are our Nanny's after all, they know what is best...and we ARE surrounded by water on all sides so it is a jail of sorts at this point anyhow.
Times like these bring out the best...and the absolute worst in people. Those who choose to be a victim (and that is just an attitude) demand ALL are victims...we must ALL suffer or it just isn't fair..
I've wondered to myself about all the memes berating the non-essential celebrities, musicians, sports stars...do those folks not watch movies? Listen to music? Enjoy the amazing physical abilities of the others? What is wrong with people? Do they never hope to go on a lovely vacation and stay in a hotel, eat restaurant food again?
This is ridiculous and it's dangerous. And I ain't talking about no coronavirus! This is bringing out the most petty, hateful and jealous emotions in the most shallow people...wow. Just wow.
After all that I sure hope those of us who pay for slips & buoys year in and year out...get a break, huh?
I live in San Juan County...own a motel and restaurants...closed by choice on the 19th mostly due to the fact that most of my employees take care of elders or have little kids & I can't fathom putting them in any danger no matter how questionable I find it all.
I really can't believe how stupid this has become. I guess Big Brother knows what's best for us dumb sheep.
 
Concerned Soldier said:
I also observed a constant stream coming in mainly from other states that are having a higher rate of infection. Freedom has always had a high cost, just ask any soldier. When we fight a war, as our commander in chief has declared the pandemic, we fight it as a nation. I am saddened to see these important supply lines and resources being divided between the states and making governors responsible for fighting a battle they are ill prepared to fight. This exercise in state's rights is delaying victory and doing a lot of damage to the economy and costing a lot of lives. I believe in states rights but the state I was born in motto is "United we stand divided we fall." The same thing is happening with the National Parks except now the head of the Department of Interior is having to deal with locals and state governors with no guidance from our president sadly except "Stay at home."
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Well...this certainly ISN'T about freedom!!! Sure, it would be just great if folks would simply protect themselves (stay home, wash your hands, buy ammo), but, you know...real freedom is the freedom to fail. To make bad decisions and take responsibility.
United States of America. Yep. United we stand divided we fall. United doesn't mean uniform...or one...and I love our President, most people wouldn't make a pimple....well you know...maybe.
 
People are coming to the realization that this could last a long time. What price do you put on your kids being locked up for one summer of their lives? People can handle a month. But when government scientists start talking about 2021? Well staying safe starts to lose it’s luster.
 
We will have anarchy before we see it extend to 2021!!! No way will the rest of the population stand for that.
Things will change whether or not it opens up by the end on the month. Its human nature,
And POTUS has been quite direct in what he has been doing. Health care for the most part is a states rights issue. To be prepared in case of emergency in your own state. Its not the federal governments role to do everything.
Our Founding Fathers would be turning over in there graves if they could see how ubiquitous the Federal Government has become and how easily lots of folks think that big government is the answer to all things. NY blew it and they are trying to blame the Federal Government for their failures. Just look at all the states and the ratio of hospital beds or ICUs to 100,000 population. Its an eye opening study.
 
I don't know how to respond to this. I don't like it, but I also don't like what is happening on the flip side. When it hits home you just don't have the same feelings. You would do anything to keep someone else from going through the pain, and you just wish you could reverse what has happened. Just got a report from a friend, and can't imagine what the family is going through right now. Hope this doesn't happen to any of you.



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Striper Slayer said:
He just announced it in his press conference. It probably hasn't hit print yet.
He said it is to keep people from out of state coming into Utah to visit the parks. Maybe he will leave it open to Utahans but it didn't sound too promising.
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Closing a National Recreation Area but leaving it "open to Utahans" would be completely illegal..its a National Recreation Area, not a State Park....
 
Not all Utahans just residents of the county that part of the National Recreation Area happens to be in. Guess according most Trump supporters there should be only state controlled lands and to the true individual rights people only local control as in county governments which is what has been proclaimed by those in control of the government at this point. Careful what you wish and vote for because sometimes you get it.
 
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People die every day. If it isn't Covid it's a flue or cancer or overdose. The scientists are running the country and they only accept proven results. Put them back in the labs and shut them up. Arizona has a whopping 2500 cases so far. Pretty slim chance of getting it here at all. I am 70 and care a lot more for freedom than I do about death. Small minded beurocrats love them some power. Put a boot on your necks once and you will have it on for life. This entire thing is ridiculous and will put us in a deep depression.
 
I think I will load up the side x side and go social distance myself while every one else sits on there butt at home!!
Have fun
Plus I will not have to talk,stand next to or be remotely close to anybody!!!
YMMV but don’t tell me I can’t go enjoy the outdoors where there is NO risk
 
It depends on where the outdoors is and if you can stay inside the county you reside in. If you come to San Juan county Utah and spend the night and are not a resident you will be fined is my understanding. Aramark is requiring employees that leave the property overnight to self isolate for two weeks without pay or lose your job I understand. In war what you are doing could be considered treason. Pretty crazy isn't it. Hope you can maintain social distancing and have some outdoors on your property.
 
Concerned Soldier said:
It depends on where the outdoors is and if you can stay inside the county you reside in. If you come to San Juan county Utah and spend the night and are not a resident you will be fined is my understanding. Aramark is requiring employees that leave the property overnight to self isolate for two weeks without pay or lose your job I understand. In war what you are doing could be considered treason. Pretty crazy isn't it. Hope you can maintain social distancing and have some outdoors on your property.
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Nope I’m going to BLM and National Forest land!
Stop me!!!
Laters
 
From what I understand it is pretty crowded in lots of places due to full time RVers (most state and local campgrounds have been closed) and people that are trying to leave metro areas, be careful out there.
 
Concerned Soldier said:
Not all Utahans just residents of the county that part of the National Recreation Area happens to be in. Guess according most Trump supporters there should be only state controlled lands and to the true individual rights people only local control as in county governments which is what has been proclaimed by those in control of the government at this point. Careful what you wish and vote for because sometimes you get it.
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I'm sorry that you have that so twisted... State's Rights folks (like myself) know that our country was set up to give the individual the power, we elect a Sheriff to protect & preserve our inalienable rights, one being the right to travel, a Sheriff, even though he/she is certainly the voice of a county, has the duty to protect the rights of ALL, you don't need to be their constituent.
You are the one who has been supportive of closure the last few days on here...and there's no such thing as 'federally owned lands' other than what the Constitution specifies (forts, ports and ten square), the rest is simply 'yet to be disposed'.
The sheriff certainly does have every authority and jurisdiction over said lands.
Question is: CAN the people be denied the right to travel between the united states? Absolutely not!!!!
DOES the Interstate Commerce Clause give the fed the power to control our state borders????
Go find the answer...and not a quick google search, look it up in the Federalist Papers and such.
Happy fishing & boating to all those brave enough to live and take responsibility for your own actions.
 
I believe you are correct in all times except in times of a national emergency or war. I believe President Trump has declared this a National Emergency and directed every American to "Stay at home". As a former soldier I have an obligation to do what the commander in chief directs even if I don't like or agree with it except in as outlined in the code of conduct. These principles are what have preserved what freedom we have in this country so far. A democracy is only as good as the people within it, I pray there are more good people than bad in this one. I may not agree with your opinions but will and have served for your right to express them. I hope everyone in this country is willing to do the same, and follow the laws set forth by the people.
 
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Concerned Soldier said:
I believe you are correct in all times except in times of a national emergency or war. I believe President Trump has declared this a National Emergency and directed every American to "Stay at home". As a former soldier I have an obligation to do what the commander in chief directs even if I don't like or agree with it except in as outlined in the code of conduct. These principles are what have preserved what freedom we have in this country so far. A democracy is only as good as the people within it, I pray there are more good people than bad in this one.
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There are more people willing to follow the directions of government officials we elected for the common good than those who will not. I don’t think that either side is good or bad, but I get what you are communicating. It’s all going to work itself out. It will take some time, but life will go on and we’ll get to go back to our shared common ’love’, Lake Powell.
 
Concerned Soldier said:
I believe you are correct in all times except in times of a national emergency or war. I believe President Trump has declared this a National Emergency and directed every American to "Stay at home". As a former soldier I have an obligation to do what the commander in chief directs even if I don't like or agree with it except in as outlined in the code of conduct. These principles are what have preserved what freedom we have in this country so far. A democracy is only as good as the people within it, I pray there are more good people than bad in this one.
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The fed has the duty to protect our borders...we have other LEO's for everything within our borders. (We're a Republic not a democracy).
Individuals also have not only the 'right' but the duty to bear arms as well...that's what a state militia is all about...or a Sheriff's Posse.
And the 2A.
 
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