Pin Anchoring

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bubba said:
Next time you see a pin hole, fill it to the tippy top with sand, pour some water on it and then flatten it out with your flip flop. If you want extra points take a broom and sweep the rock around it to dust the same color sand on the wet spot. It really is this easy - it’s a miracle.



Just add sand - problem solved.
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That is amazing. You are saying that you and your friends are able to adequately fill a pin hole with sand/water and that alone leaves no trace at all? I thought that these rocks were made over thousands of years and under enormous amounts of pressure. But a bottle of water, sand and a broom makes sense too.
 
How could a Ranger (or anyone for that matter) know if a houseboat was secured using a "new" vs a "old" hole?

Either way, I am curious to hear the response NPS would give to an inquiry to them with a photo of an identifiable boat, moored using pins.
 
Ryan,

they do not know for sure but they know where the holes are. I can go to almost any cove below Last chance and show you where the holes are. The rangers know this also.

You can go on the lake today and find many many boats on pins. Pretty much any boat thats all white is on pins LOL. You can not secure a Adonia or large Bravada with anchors. If the Rangers wanted to give tickets today they could give 20. I am surprised that you guys act like its not happening right now.

If highway patrol stopped giving tickets for speeding on I-15 and everyone knew it would you still go the speed limit? maybe you would but i would d be going the same speed as everyone else.

Mike
 
Michael Pyle said:
Ryan,

they do not know for sure but they know where the holes are. I can go to almost any cove below Last chance and show you where the holes are. The rangers know this also.

You can go on the lake today and find many many boats on pins. Pretty much any boat thats all white is on pins LOL. You can not secure a Adonia or large Bravada with anchors. If the Rangers wanted to give tickets today they could give 20. I am surprised that you guys act like its not happening right now.

If highway patrol stopped giving tickets for speeding on I-15 and everyone knew it would you still go the speed limit? maybe you would but i would d be going the same speed as everyone else.

Mike
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I don't know the first thing about securing a houseboat. My questions about the entire process would be many, but why is it the newer boats cant be anchored? Sheer size/weight? Thanks
 
Yes the size and side load. a 3 story houseboat is a huge sail. The longer the boat the longer the arm against the anchor point. There is no anchor in sand that will hold a 80ft long 3 story houseboat in 80 mph winds. If you made all the big boats stop using pins you would have a major mess during a light wind storm. Its not just the new boats. the big boats made back in the late 90's got too large for anchors.

Mike
 
Michael Pyle said:
Ryan,

they do not know for sure but they know where the holes are. I can go to almost any cove below Last chance and show you where the holes are. The rangers know this also.

You can go on the lake today and find many many boats on pins. Pretty much any boat thats all white is on pins LOL. You can not secure a Adonia or large Bravada with anchors. If the Rangers wanted to give tickets today they could give 20. I am surprised that you guys act like its not happening right now.

If highway patrol stopped giving tickets for speeding on I-15 and everyone knew it would you still go the speed limit? maybe you would but i would d be going the same speed as everyone else.

Mike
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To be clear, I'm not acting like I don't know its happening. I do. And, honestly, I am undecided on if it REALLY is a problem or not, but I am clear that under current regulations it is illegal. Enforcement (or lack there of) is a completely different subject, and one that comes up on this board very often on different subjects.

I've only seen pinning happen in the San Juan, but I am a Northender. I do think it is more common on the south side of the lake, as that is where the bigger boats are.

And, for the record, the boat I am partners on is one of the largest boats on the north end. We are able to secure the boat safely without using pins. But we aren't a three story boat. And those water bags that have been discussed on this site sure seem like they would solve the pinning "problem", for what isn't a HUGE sum of money (especially in comparison with what the new luxury boats cost - not a slight at the economics of it, just a observation on the size of investment).
 
Ryan,

I agree.

The water bags look interesting for sure.

Just about every cove in the south end of the lake has pin holes. Most of them are in cracks. If we are going to use a old hole we will pick one in a crack and not on a smooth face. personally I don't like when people drill in the open. I also get pissed when I see people carve their names in the sandstone. When we started going to Powell in the mid 90's we went with a group that carved Merry Christmas in the wall to take Christmas photos. I was shocked when I saw it and so embarrassed. Fortunately I have not seen that since but do see names a lot.

Our boat has full second deck with 1/4 3rd deck so not as bad as many of the larger newer boats and we can get huge loads on our anchors. When we get a wind from the side it's scary.

For the record we use large anchors most of the time, just ask my two boys how many huge holes they have dug in the sand. LOL

Mike
 
Michael Pyle said:
Yes the size and side load. a 3 story houseboat is a huge sail. The longer the boat the longer the arm against the anchor point. There is no anchor in sand that will hold a 80ft long 3 story houseboat in 80 mph winds. If you made all the big boats stop using pins you would have a major mess during a light wind storm. Its not just the new boats. the big boats made back in the late 90's got too large for anchors.

Mike
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How long is that 3 story houseboat and how far off the water is the first deck?
 
Although it has been posted many times, I will restate what the most serious problem is with pin anchoring: When an irresponsible party leaves their beach anchorage with rebar still in the sandstone. I, too, dislike seeing the holes in the sandstone, but a four-foot piece of rebar protruding from the sandstone is a real hazard to swimmers and boaters. As a18-year veteran of the Trash Tracker, my team and I have personally dislodged MANY pieces of rebar. Twice we have removed all four rebar anchors from a single beach. It is disgusting that people would leave a beach like that. I realize it is virtually unenforceable, but those people should not be allowed in GCNRA ever again.
Trash Tracker Eric
 
In a thousand years the people of the future will come along and see the hole and asses that they were made while dislodging huge sand stone rock to form a dam down stream...... It's just a couple hundred holes in a huge eco system. You guys are making a lot more out of it than needed....

I agree that I don't like to find pins still in place once a houseboat leaves but then they may have plans to return soon, who knows.
 
Let me see if I got this correct, A Law or Rule is made for the Greater good of the Park and Eco System, Then a select group doesn't like it and disregards it for their benefit. Well How about this option, for the greater good to creat an even playing field we the people will allow a certain amount of holes for the Big boats and in exchange for that you let us use your boats.

This is with tongue in cheek and with the increased world population Lake Powell will be a mess one day soon.
 
I’ve never used nor moored a houseboat, but I came within a couple feet of putting an abandoned pin anchor that was a about a foot under water through the bow of my fishing boat. Not cool.
 
I hope, Everyone is against leaving pins or using rebar as a pin. Almost everyone I see using them have a pretty decent system of using stainless Steel pins and drilling the holes bigger than the pins so they are easily removed. I would suspect most of those old pins are from years ago, specially the rebar ones??
 
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