Beach Bag mess

nzaugg

Well-Known Member
When I saw the bags last week in and around Padre Bay, they didn't really look like spots I would be interested in. The ones I saw were largely out in the open in semi-protected coves but without any wind breaks of any kind. Seemed like the sand was nice, but that isn't the kind of house boating we like to do. It seemed odd that they had so many spots taken up though and they also had a lot of radio chatter on 16. I think it would be fine if they take spots that couldn't be utilized without drilling anchors though, like if they placed bags on sandstone, like the original intent seemed to be, but they appear to be taking sandy locations that can be handled with standard anchorage.
 

azpowell

Member
the big positive on using the beach bags over standard anchors on the massive boats is that they can shift under extreme circumstances like micro bursts instead off pulling the anchor. the beach bag can move a few feet and still maintain its original holding power where a normal anchor would have pulled out.
camp where you want but I wouldn't recommend tying up to their bags unless you are planning on paying for the anchor service. they just might show up to remove the bags and untie your lines leaving you scrambling to get your boat secured.
this is their first year offering the service so folks should be mindful of growing pains of any small business. I can imagine the scheduling of that service is rough having to depend on a houseboat captain to arrive on a certain beach at a certain time and then leave that beach on their scheduled day/time as well. I'm sure no one in this forum has run into issues while leaving the marina that set them back a few hours or left the beach a day early.

Hanlon's Razor
 

Peto

Escalante-Class Member
r where a normal anchor would have pulled out.
camp where you want but I wouldn't recommend tying up to their bags unless you are planning on paying for the anchor service. they just might show up to remove
Then you are doing it wrong.....
 

Dangling Dooley

Active Member
I prefer remote spots.
I hope they end up never putting them beyond Padre Bay. Imagine rolling up to the far back left side canyon of Dry Rock Creek and seeing it's reserved. Seems there is always a houseboat there regardless though. :ROFLMAO: Maybe one day in my lifetime it will be open! But seriously, I would hate to see them passed Padre. MAYBE put a few in Oak Bay too, but that's it!

Otherwise, If you want beach bags further up lake, you have to set them up yourselves and bring them back with you. The beauty and serenity of the mid-lake and the San Juan cannot be disturbed by vacant beach bags.
 

Beachin It

Active Member
At major ski resorts these days, you can pay $50 -$100 supplement for your lift ticket each day and go to the front of the lift line. Disney charges $20 per person per ride to do the same thing over and above their Genie+ or FastPass system. Two tiers for those who have the money. Kind of like flying first class. First to board, extra room and services. It’s a growing mentality getting out of control.
Comparing apples to oranges!
 

nzaugg

Well-Known Member
My take on this is that the beach bag operator is effectively operating an unauthorized concession on the recreational area property. If this is permitted by the NPS, then I'm looking forward to some energetic entrepreneurs opening an ice cream and hot dog barge in, say, Friendship Cove. :)
They are an authorized concessionaire though. Also, there are concession contracts available for mobile food services. I think it means food trucks, but I would love it to be on the water ice cream!
 

BobT

Active Member
At major ski resorts these days, you can pay $50 -$100 supplement for your lift ticket each day and go to the front of the lift line. Disney charges $20 per person per ride to do the same thing over and above their Genie+ or FastPass system. Two tiers for those who have the money. Kind of like flying first class. First to board, extra room and services. It’s a growing mentality getting out of control.
Those are private entities and/or leases. NOT Federal, Public lands. My bitch with it is it's just another case of bringing everything down to the lowest common denominator. Remember when you had to know what you were doing to accomplish some things? You had to make the effort to find beach, learn how to anchor, and you got a bit better each time? My solution for the rich (that I have no problem with) would be to hire the experience and take them along to do the things they're either unable or unwilling to do. They're part of you party. Pay for it that way. Don't befoul the beaches or block those that get up early and make the effort to get out there.
 

FantaSea

Active Member
My views allign with JFRCalifornia and PBH. Third party’s who stake out spots for paying customers should be held responsible with ownership contact and dates of occupancy on those bags. They should also not be left unattended for more than 24 hours after initial placement. Similar to a campground reservation system, if you don’t show up within 24 hours of your bag placement the site is open to anyone. This service seems pretty ridiculous to me honestly especially in a national park with so much availability.
 

Kevin G

Well-Known Member
the big positive on using the beach bags over standard anchors on the massive boats is that they can shift under extreme circumstances like micro bursts instead off pulling the anchor. the beach bag can move a few feet and still maintain its original holding power where a normal anchor would have pulled out.
camp where you want but I wouldn't recommend tying up to their bags unless you are planning on paying for the anchor service. they just might show up to remove the bags and untie your lines leaving you scrambling to get your boat secured.
this is their first year offering the service so folks should be mindful of growing pains of any small business. I can imagine the scheduling of that service is rough having to depend on a houseboat captain to arrive on a certain beach at a certain time and then leave that beach on their scheduled day/time as well. I'm sure no one in this forum has run into issues while leaving the marina that set them back a few hours or left the beach a day early.

Hanlon's Razor
I am absolutely fine with an enterprising new business start up offering this service. But the service should not include being able to reserve spots in a National Recreation Area. The area belongs to the public. Everyone has the right to use it, but no one has the right to lay claim to it. If the B-Bags were placed at the time a houseboat arrives to anchor, I think everyone would be just fine with it. But when they are scrambling out to reserve the best spots for their customers, essentially they are making everyone "pay to play" in the best areas of the park. Should not be permitted, ever. Nor should leaving "fake camps" for days at a time to hold a spot. Park Service should be on the lookout for this happening and leave ticket those who are doing it.
 

Havalina

Escalante-Class Member
That type of action would likely be considered vandalism at the least, and possibly felony property damage.
You are 100% correct on that! The correct term is criminal mischief and the difference between a felony and a misdermenor is the dollar amount. There is no difference between those bags, a tent, or a houseboat. I still don’t care for them being placed out there though when not in use.
 

Dorado

Escalante-Class Member
I think my comfort zone on this is that if there is clear evidence that someone actually from the party in question has already occupied the space with something they put there—evidence they were actually there—such as a chair, tent, coolers, cabana, then it is occupied. Move on. But if you’re paying a third party to stake out a spot for you in advance with a beach bag, that is not right. That is a beach reservation system. You should be rewarded for your own efforts, not just be able to pay your way to the front of the line…
Really getting into the weeds on this topic...but...The devil is in the details. I agree with the idea that if you are truly "occupying" a spot, nobody should "take" it as a matter of courtesy and fair play. But, we all know that many times people put out things to appear as if someone is occupying the spot as a way to reserve it for later use. This is where I find it questionable, and really pretty hard to defend if someone notices that there actually is nobody using the spot and camps there.
 

Brent

Well-Known Member
I'm really surprised a representative from Beach Bags isn't chiming in on here. I know for a fact they follow waynes words. Good marketing
Really getting into the weeds on this topic...but...The devil is in the details. I agree with the idea that if you are truly "occupying" a spot, nobody should "take" it as a matter of courtesy and fair play. But, we all know that many times people put out things to appear as if someone is occupying the spot as a way to reserve it for later use. This is where I find it questionable, and really pretty hard to defend if someone notices that there actually is nobody using the spot and camps there.
We launch our houseboat around 6:30 to 7:00am almost every year. I also launch the ski boat just before the houseboat. In the past I would depart Wawheap area asap and go and find our spot for the week. After I find our spot, I drop off a few crew members, a full igloo, chairs and a ez up if they want it. I then drive the ski boat back and find the houseboat and inform them were we are.

That is how it should be.

This year will all the "tight" spots, Wahweap narrows and Antelope Marina, I'm going to stay on the houseboat and only depart it after we are past Antelope. That will still give me a good 1 1/2 to 2 hours head start on the houseboat to find our destination for the week.
 
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