Anyone see this.

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24 Sleekenforcer said:
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I don't know, this picture looks like someone wants to dissuade the public from going out to this site. They tell us "it's been removed" but this little metal triangle appears to be to the right of the monolith and nearer to the cliff. Where the drainage comes out, it aims right to the monolith. Look at the indentations in the sandstone in the foreground. It doesn't line up. Compare to this picture of the monolith from the original article. They look like they're in two completely different spots. Until someone posts a sweeping video of the whole area, I have a hard time believing that it's already been removed.... Whomever took that picture above looks like the monolith is just out of the picture to the left.

Tiff

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Tiff Mapel said:
I don't know, this picture looks like someone wants to dissuade the public from going out to this site. They tell us "it's been removed" but this little metal triangle appears to be to the right of the monolith and nearer to the cliff. Where the drainage comes out, it aims right to the monolith. Look at the indentations in the sandstone in the foreground. It doesn't line up. Compare to this picture of the monolith from the original article. They look like they're in two completely different spots. Until someone posts a sweeping video of the whole area, I have a hard time believing that it's already been removed.... Whomever took that picture above looks like the monolith is just out of the picture to the left.

Tiff

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I think you are right Tiff!!! The pic of the pyramid has a shadow to the left on the cliff - looking at the shadow in the "notch" it would line up perfectly with the monolith!! I THINK SOME WWORDLING IS MESSIN WITH US!!!:LOL:
 
My niece and her husband traveled to check it out over the weekend and confirm that it has been removed. Not quite firsthand information, but I don't see how they gain by saying it was removed when it was not. I'm glad it's gone as more damage to this area was probably done in the last week than the last 100 years. Good job America.
 
Well, I've seen the written accounts that it's been removed. Thank goodness. Too many people were going out there and trashing the place.

Like the group who took it down said, "Leave no trace."

Tiff
 
My sarcasm wonders "what if" the native americans had left no trace? What would we know about them without petroglyphs, camp fire rings, and grinding stones left for us that we all love to see and find? Not to start an argument, just saying. I know there will be backlash but only meant as food for thought.
 
Dworwood said:
My sarcasm wonders "what if" the native americans had left no trace? What would we know about them without petroglyphs, camp fire rings, and grinding stones left for us that we all love to see and find? Not to start an argument, just saying. I know there will be backlash but only meant as food for thought.
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Totally valid point. I think it boils down to the question of "do the things left behind materially contribute to our understanding of past cultures?", which is how a historian or archaeologist would evaluate cultural resources they find. You can argue that the monolith said something about our culture, certainly Glen Canyon Dam does, and that's how you determine the "value" of leaving it behind, at least from the standpoint of relevant laws that guide that sort of evaluation.

Is there a fine line between graffiti and petroglyphs? Modern trash and ancient artifacts? Wooden shacks and Anasazi ruins? Sure. I've asked many of my archaeologist friends in the business that very question, and they admit there's a gray area there. For most of them, it boils down to the idea that the ancient resources we find are scattered and few, and provide great clues as to where and how people used to live. Modern graffiti and trash is everywhere, made by anyone, and thus doesn't really contribute to our (or future generations) understanding of our present culture, except to the extent we've been everywhere, throw out a lot of things, use a lot of plastic, and that "Tammi loves Dave", at least when they scribbled that on the wall in 2017.
 
JFRCalifornia said:
Yep. And actually right in my hometown! So I'm going to wander up there this afternoon to see if it's still there... or maybe I was the one who moved it from Utah to Atascadero, CA...
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Okay... just went up to Pine Mountain here in Atascadero--and it's already gone! That monolith moves fast... Here's a couple of photos of the hike, including one of the foundation where it was...pretty nice hike! Pine Mtn 2.jpgPine Mtn 1.jpgPine Mtn 4.jpg
 
>>>>I think it boils down to the question of "do the things left behind materially contribute to our understanding of past cultures?",

Can't wait to hear what future geologists a million years from now will say about the sedimentary layers of the future geologic formation of lake powell: mixed with fishing rods and lures, beer bottles, boats, deflated swim toys, beach chairs, tents etc.
 
Canyon Glen said:
>>>>I think it boils down to the question of "do the things left behind materially contribute to our understanding of past cultures?",

Can't wait to hear what future geologists a million years from now will say about the sedimentary layers of the future geologic formation of lake powell: mixed with fishing rods and lures, beer bottles, boats, deflated swim toys, beach chairs, tents etc.
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They'll call it the Anthropogenic Formation.

That reminds me of the scene toward the very end of the original Planet of the Apes, where there is a cave along the beach that the chimp archaeologists have been studying the contents for years, layer by layer. And what puzzles them is that they come across a buried layer that contains a human doll that talks! How is that possible on a planet where apes rule and humans can't talk? Of course, Dr. Zaius, the orangutan Minister of Science and Religion, knows the truth about the planet's past, and so his way of dealing with that is to "seal the cave" by blowing it up. It was his way of preserving the ape culture.

Future researchers are indeed going to be scratching their heads over the trash at the bottom of the lake (or more likely buried mudflats) in the millennia to come...
 
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