Lost a big one!

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krusty_45 said:
I dont understand the "pilot" situation. As the rules clearly state.

Services Not Permitted​

These types of commercial services are not offered through the CUA Program or authorized under any other permit from Glen Canyon National Recreation Area:

  • Vessel Piloting Services (Pilot for hire of personal vessels or rental vessels)
  • Commercial Boat Tours, to include, but not limited to, private boat charters and photography boat tours
  • Delivery or pick-up of any out-of-park rentals, including, but not limited to, the following:
    • RVs
    • Houseboats
    • Camping Equipment or "Drop Camps"
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As I understand it, the CUA Program is for off-lake out-of-park businesses. Antelope Point, Aramark, and until recently, Ticaboo Outpost, are all concessionaires. They operate under a different agreement. I'm assuming the pilot was part of Antelope Point (where the boat is normally slipped).
 
BartsPlace said:
As I understand it, the CUA Program is for off-lake out-of-park businesses. Antelope Point, Aramark, and until recently, Ticaboo Outpost, are all concessionaires. They operate under a different agreement. I'm assuming the pilot was part of Antelope Point (where the boat is normally slipped).
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Ah yes, sorry for my ignorance. Of course Aramark/Antelope would have pilots for hire.

On a second note. Good riddance of this boat and I hope they don't get another with a chopper on it. One year we were camped in Warm Creek and they were continually doing joy flights. They were dive bombing over the cliff / amphitheaters edge that we were camping below. Quite a change in the environment when theres a chopper pulling as hard as it can to come out of a dive directly above you, for multiple days.
 
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The insurance on our current boat requires any owner with less than something like 5 years of experience operating a similar size vessel is required to hire a pilot for entering and leaving the slip.

And don’t take this as gospel, but I am almost certain that when we first bought on, I read the contract on the pilot service and there was something in it that absolved them from liability when driving the boat.
 
Ryan said:
The insurance on our current boat requires any owner with less than something like 5 years of experience operating a similar size vessel is required to hire a pilot for entering and leaving the slip.

And don’t take this as gospel, but I am almost certain that when we first bought on, I read the contract on the pilot service and there was something in it that absolved them from liability when driving the boat.
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most contracts with Aramark require you to hold them harmless if you are in slip or buoy. Unsure if Antelope requires the same, but it would surprise me if it does not.

Another thing to keep in mind -- when you sign that contract with Aramark, the contract says you will name them as additional insd and waive subrogation against them--- Generally your insurance company will only do those items if you request it -- and some carriers will not do it at all---

If you do not request, or your carrier does not do this, you might have a serious problem if there is a loss like this.
 
We were pulling off at Stateline watching cells come in from the South East & West at around 3pm. The leading edge wind event from the SW cell was pretty good with gusts probably in the +35 MPH range but nothing to unusual for summer monsoon season at Powell. We were driving out of the Park about 45 minutes later with steady rain & maybe 15-20 MPH sustained winds. We could see a lot of boats coming down the main channel probably trying to get out of the storm cell and back to Wahweap. Boats under power should have had no problems staying steady in the conditions. Loose power though and anyone would have been SOL in that cell with the leading edge wind event, especially a large vessel.
 
I found this article. A crew with a remotely piloted vehicle out of San Diego has recovered vessels as deep as 450 feet. However, this is probably larger than anything else they have successfully refloated:

Post in thread 'Sunk Houseboat Lake Powell' Sunk Houseboat Lake Powell
 
DeepVee said:
So this is the second big houseboat that has gone down this year with a hired "Captain" or "Pilot" in control... This should never happen with a qualified person at the helm or these boats have a serious design flaw. We were at the lake on Saturday when the storm cell hit & had just pulled off at Stateline. The leading edge microburst was bad but no worse than any typical storm cell at Powell during the summer.
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I was thinking the same - major design flaw.
 
Ed_on_WD said:
I found this article. A crew with a remotely piloted vehicle out of San Diego has recovered vessels as deep as 450 feet. However, this is probably larger than anything else they have successfully refloated:

Post in thread 'Sunk Houseboat Lake Powell' Sunk Houseboat Lake Powell
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Great link, thanks! Some great diving info. I was a NAUI Instructor back in the day, but 300 FT (at 3540 elevation) is truly submersible territory.

That guy's line 'the only diving I'm doing, is into my cooler' might be very valid.....if he stays at the dock....

:cool:

Gonna be interesting to see how this plays out. My guess is the ins. co. will throw $100K at it with submersibles before writing a $2M check.
 
Rainbowbridge said:
Great link, thanks! Some great diving info. I was a NAUI Instructor back in the day, but 300 FT (at 3540 elevation) is truly submersible territory.

That guy's line 'the only diving I'm doing, is into my cooler' might be very valid.....if he stays at the dock....

:cool:

Gonna be interesting to see how this plays out. My guess is the ins. co. will throw $100K at it with submersibles before writing a $2M check.
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The pre-lake elevation of the river surface at that location was about 3160. Probably not tons of silt at the bottom has accumulated there because it's still far from the dam (where it would tend to build up more), but accounting for some siltation, the lake in that spot is probably somewhere around 350 feet deep or more...
 
Design flaw perhaps, but hard to understand a decision to push through weather especially with every luxury on board.

Why not play it safe, hunker down for the night?

It’s like that show “Air Disasters”…there’s usually a combination of factors that individually won’t cause an incident but put ‘em all together and FUBAR.
 
Just curious, but has the NPS weighed in on this accident? Have they set a deadline for a salvage operation to begin? Has anyone spotted a sheen of fuel or oil rising from the wreck? Is the floating debris being cleared?

Does anybody know what's going on currently, and what the plan might be? We're coming up on a week since the accident. I'd think the insurance company would have started some kind of mitigation effort by now, if only to avoid tremendous fines.
 
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Ed_on_WD said:
Just curious, but has the NPS weighed in on this accident? Have they set a deadline for a salvage operation to begin? Has anyone spotted a sheen of fuel or oil rising from the wreck? Is the floating debris being cleared?

Does anybody know what's going on currently, and what the plan might be? We're coming up on a week since the accident. I'd think the insurance company would have started some kind of mitigation effort by now, if only to avoid tremendous fines.
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When it happened there was a smell of diesel through that part of the channel, I would imagine it’s gone by now. As far as I know all of the debris was removed right after it sank, and at 300 ft deep I doubt it will be recovered.
 
Not sure if the link will work, as I don't have instagram, but my wife showed me this video which shows the boat right as it slips under. I think the music was poor taste, but very interesting.

www.instagram.com

POWELLHEADZ ® on Instagram: "“Knockers” final moments 🤯💔 such a sad deal 😢 We need another @heavydsparks recovery . 🎥 TT ahylenbenitez"

7,172 likes, 342 comments - powellheadz on June 29, 2022: "“Knockers” final moments 🤯💔 such a sad deal 😢 We need another @heavydsparks recovery . 🎥 TT ahylenbenitez".
www.instagram.com www.instagram.com
 
SkibumUT said:
Not sure if the link will work, as I don't have instagram, but my wife showed me this video which shows the boat right as it slips under. I think the music was poor taste, but very interesting.

www.instagram.com

POWELLHEADZ ® on Instagram: "“Knockers” final moments 🤯💔 such a sad deal 😢 We need another @heavydsparks recovery . 🎥 TT ahylenbenitez"

7,172 likes, 342 comments - powellheadz on June 29, 2022: "“Knockers” final moments 🤯💔 such a sad deal 😢 We need another @heavydsparks recovery . 🎥 TT ahylenbenitez".
www.instagram.com www.instagram.com
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The music is amazing lol. No one was hurt right? Titanic is exactly what everyone was thinking.
 
Line said:
When it happened there was a smell of diesel through that part of the channel,
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I didn't think anyone had diesel available on the lake so I assumed all of the big houseboats were still gasoline. Is Antelope supplying diesel at their pumps?
 
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