Boat Crash Outside Escalante
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Lance Cue
Well-Known Member
Let me rephrase that before i offend anyone. I believe the days of red & green on the front and white on the back should be done. With the new lighting now a days, i believe white on the front would be much safer for everyone. Who can see anything in front of them with the red/green lights? Unless maybe a full moon. I'm not normally a big fan of change but I think this law should change, at least for inland lakes if no other. I run the river in the winter at 4:30am in colorado with a light bar and two smaller lights off the sides to go duck hunting and couldn't safely do it otherwise, most days. Illegal, yes. Necessary, yes. We just dont get checked that early. I feel this law makes any night travel at Powell very dangerous and when necessary, sometimes impossible.
Michael Pyle
Well-Known Member
I drive at night often thru Lake Powell. Seems like every trip we need to pick someone up at the marina and take to camp.
Personally I don’t think forward white lights help much at night unless you are going slow or the lights are crazy bright. The light blows out your night vision and makes it really hard to see where you are going.
All this week the moon has been pretty bright so if you knew where you were you should be fine.
I like the red green and white Nav lights to help figure out where traffic is going. I worry more about hitting another boat at night than land.
I use MotionX-gps app to make tracks durIng the day that I follow at night. Makes night nav much safer.
Personally I don’t think forward white lights help much at night unless you are going slow or the lights are crazy bright. The light blows out your night vision and makes it really hard to see where you are going.
All this week the moon has been pretty bright so if you knew where you were you should be fine.
I like the red green and white Nav lights to help figure out where traffic is going. I worry more about hitting another boat at night than land.
I use MotionX-gps app to make tracks durIng the day that I follow at night. Makes night nav much safer.
This topic regarding the use of proper boat lights is timely to me.
I cruised in from Dungeon Canyon to APM late last Sunday evening arriving at around 11:30 p.m. - later than expected after providing a tow in for a stranded/damaged boat.
I was far more comfortable piloting to the marina (via lake knowledge, moonlight and Navionics map on chart plotter) than THROUGH the marina, primarily because of oblivious boaters within the marina cruising around with their white docking lights or tower lights on pointed directly at me and completely ruining my night vision. And there were at least two boats cruising through the marina with NO lights on at all! I didn't even see them until I was probably 30 ft away from them - luckily they were to the side of me and not in front of me. On top of that, several docked houseboats had their aft floodlights on, I suppose because it lets them see the other side of the shore and is pretty from behind the lights, but completely inappropriate!
Come on people! There is a reason green/red bow lights along with an aft white light has been the law for many years - it works! If everyone (or even most) followed this law, we'd all know which direction the boats around us were going! As soon as ONE boat turns there big bright white lights on in close quarters, all bets are off. Ridiculous and oblivious boaters really PO me and there were plenty out late Sunday night. It really reinforced to me how uninformed (I'll be nice) so many boaters are.
I do understand there are valid reasons to use big white spot lights - that's why boats have them, but using them in close quarter marina maneuvering IS NOT ONE OF THEM! (the exception of course is when entering your dock slip - that's what docking lights are officially made for NOT cruising around with them on!)
p.s. - I also noted that the channel market buoys are not maintained to enable safe navigation buoy to buoy as they once were. Again, come on National Park Service - isn't it important for you to maintain these navigation markers? This problem was noted in the 2015/6(?) NPS inspection but have still not been fixed. Unacceptable!! Some of the buoys don't even have reflective tape on them anymore making them just a night navigating hazard!
I cruised in from Dungeon Canyon to APM late last Sunday evening arriving at around 11:30 p.m. - later than expected after providing a tow in for a stranded/damaged boat.
I was far more comfortable piloting to the marina (via lake knowledge, moonlight and Navionics map on chart plotter) than THROUGH the marina, primarily because of oblivious boaters within the marina cruising around with their white docking lights or tower lights on pointed directly at me and completely ruining my night vision. And there were at least two boats cruising through the marina with NO lights on at all! I didn't even see them until I was probably 30 ft away from them - luckily they were to the side of me and not in front of me. On top of that, several docked houseboats had their aft floodlights on, I suppose because it lets them see the other side of the shore and is pretty from behind the lights, but completely inappropriate!
Come on people! There is a reason green/red bow lights along with an aft white light has been the law for many years - it works! If everyone (or even most) followed this law, we'd all know which direction the boats around us were going! As soon as ONE boat turns there big bright white lights on in close quarters, all bets are off. Ridiculous and oblivious boaters really PO me and there were plenty out late Sunday night. It really reinforced to me how uninformed (I'll be nice) so many boaters are.
I do understand there are valid reasons to use big white spot lights - that's why boats have them, but using them in close quarter marina maneuvering IS NOT ONE OF THEM! (the exception of course is when entering your dock slip - that's what docking lights are officially made for NOT cruising around with them on!)
p.s. - I also noted that the channel market buoys are not maintained to enable safe navigation buoy to buoy as they once were. Again, come on National Park Service - isn't it important for you to maintain these navigation markers? This problem was noted in the 2015/6(?) NPS inspection but have still not been fixed. Unacceptable!! Some of the buoys don't even have reflective tape on them anymore making them just a night navigating hazard!
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Docker
Well-Known Member
By insufficient lighting I meant that instead of having a high powered spot light on board to point out canyon walls and islands they only had small flash lights. The main thing was probably that they were traveling much too fast for their lighting conditions. If you aren't very knowledgeable of hazards on the main channel you probably shouldn't be driving so fast in the dark. Especially if you have a boat full of people. Not to mention it appeared to be a very new MasterCraft. Talk about a disappointing night!!
Goblin
Well-Known Member
The navigation lights convention/rules were adopted in 1838 and are still considered to be vital for safety and deconfliction from other vessels. This convention also applies to aircraft, is equally important for them although it was applied to them a few years later, Jules Verne excepted.
Of course if you are the only vessel on the planet it would be very valuable to have a spotlight rated at 1.21 gigawatts of power to illuminate and even X-ray everything in front of you. While this may increase safety if you're a singleton, it is only an illusion if you are sharing the water with , well, anyone else. Mutual night blindness, disorientation and a reduced ability to evaluate position, direction and speed is all that is afforded to everyone with the aforementioned 1.21 gigawatt spotlight in use which is better suited to DeLorean time travel, not night navigation. Of course, if the mariner involved is of the type that is super-smart and hyper-wise they will just ignore the law because they certainly know what is best and nothing anyone says will make a difference. In addition, if you are the only, only then there is nobody there to write a ticket, or at least ya hope so.
People should perhaps try and understand the nature of 180 years of maritime law in the safe conduct of night ops for all simultaneously and not just how it affects their own personal situation at any particular moment in time.
This is a fellow pulling into Friendship Cove last year with his new light bar from Costco called:
"The Unscheduled Sunrise"
While it was kinda cool, I must admit it was a tad distracting at 3 AM.
FWIW,
Goblin
Meatwagon
Keeper of San Juan Secrets
I used to motor my boat at night back on the Mississippi River, and learned from watching the barge drivers on the use of the spot lights. The barges have VERY LARGE spot lights, they would swing their light back and forth to stay between the channel bouy and lift the light up and over other boats in the channel as not to blind them.
Red Rock Paradise
Active Member
There are pros and cons to white forward facing lights. I am personally against the stationary light bars since people never turn them off as they travel on the lake and you can't tell it you are behind them or infront of them (yes I have come across someone that had both forward facing and rear facing light bars on).
I have a spot light on my boat meant for rocks and buoys, i avoid pointing it at other boats. I also have another tool on my boat which helps with boats that are running without lights, radar. With these 2 tools and running at a slow speed I have never run over a rock that is above the surface. I have hit a rock that was underwater and thankfully the only damage was to my prop and I carry 2 spares on board so after a quick prop change I was back underway.
I have a spot light on my boat meant for rocks and buoys, i avoid pointing it at other boats. I also have another tool on my boat which helps with boats that are running without lights, radar. With these 2 tools and running at a slow speed I have never run over a rock that is above the surface. I have hit a rock that was underwater and thankfully the only damage was to my prop and I carry 2 spares on board so after a quick prop change I was back underway.
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