Great Lakes Airlines shuts down

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I need an interpreter too!
Weeds,
I hope to meetup w//Dick, Mary and Cropduster next week, providing Tuesday's annual goes OK.
We have 3 T-6's here in Heber City.
 
There was an FBO in the mid-west in the late 60s that designed their ramp with a couple of fueling spots for Falcon 20s. You'd taxi into a slight dip with the nose wheel, raising the wing tips and get a lot more fuel on board. Everyone stopped somewhere in the mid-west for fuel when they had CJ610s. Coming west bound to KVNY we needed 2000# crossing the Colorado River or we couldn't make VNY with any reserves in a 20 series Lear.

Repo went smooth. Got a call and they said they needed a 727 repo'd I said where is it and they said it was in So Calif. I said I know which one it is He said how do you know that. I said I knew all 3 private 727s in Calif and only one owner was in financial trouble. :-)

Nice guy taking the chicken!

It seems odd to me but I watch all these new guys launching their plastic Cirrus airplanes and I could launch a 757 in about half the time it takes them to move off the tie down.

I've got 5 airlines and 7 corporations on my resume and all of them are dead except the last one Frontier. Maybe I had a black cloud overhead as everywhere I went they died after I got there.

Now every day is Saturday !!!!!
 
Forgot to add. 20 Lears burned as much fuel per hour taxiing as they did at 410. Fuel critical on takeoff. We delayed the second engine start until near the end of the runway. Turn off hyd pumps, steer with brakes and start the second engine while rolling. Takes a little practice to do it smooth.
 
Cliff said:
Jim Have they done anything in Heber City to straighten out the FBO issues yet?
Click to expand...
They got a nasty, legal letter from the FAA about competitive pricing and public access. There was a second FBO applicant a few years ago, but they pulled out rather than fight in court. They city council would likely approve one now. The existing FBO has filed a couple of suits with the city. OK3's current 100LL price is 6.34/gal. They want prop planes to go away and only deal with jets. I buy most of my fuel in Page.
 
Hand flying a 20 series in the weather would test a person. You couldn't come down fast, or you couldn't hold the cabin. If you had the anti-ice on, you really had a predicament if you were in a hurry to descend.
I am in a Lear 60 now, and it is a climbing beast, but a little more civilized.
 
Cliff...it does sound like a black cloud...I thought we had it bad.
Linda was a flight attendant with United; Hughes Air Worst; Continental; Northwest...and finally Delta.
Just Western and Delta for me.
On the Lear we got a ton of green stamps at Flower Aviation during fuel stops...or Omaha steaks at Lincoln.
I'm sure you remember the Prist.

Hey Jim, I had to put Dick & Mary off twice for the straps/ratchet anchor thing. Linda and I have had the flu now for over 2 weeks and counting. (They say 3 weeks is normal)
Anyway we were going up Monday the 2nd...then the 9th and now hope for the 16th.
Googled Heber City and saw the CAF there...is the PV-2 flyable?
 
Harpoon is out of annual, but flyable. They are waiting for an engine part for port engine to finish annual. It is perfectly restored to original. Owner died, so it is for sale.
Lots of retired Western/Delta guys in Heber. I remember the days, the Champagne Airline! I ended up with 860,000 miles on the two.
I'll still be there on the 16th. K-42, next to Dick's old houseboat.
 
Thanks Jim,
If you get a chance jot down the "N" number.
Aviation Specialties at Falcon field in Mesa had about 7 of them.
Flew 3 different ones...one of em is at the museum in Palm Springs.
It still has the augers inside the wings to dispense ground up corn cob grits laced with Myrex.
Did a number on fire ants...

Western was great...hated to see it go to Delta.
Probably see you on the 16th. then.
 
weeds said:
Thanks Jim,
If you get a chance jot down the "N" number.
Aviation Specialties at Falcon field in Mesa had about 7 of them.
Flew 3 different ones...one of em is at the museum in Palm Springs.
It still has the augers inside the wings to dispense ground up corn cob grits laced with Myrex.
Did a number on fire ants...

Western was great...hated to see it go to Delta.
Probably see you on the 16th. then.
Click to expand...
Google it, Attu Warrior PV 2. There are many videos at Osh Gosh, etc.
 
YUP loose the cabin easy in a 20 series. World of difference between a 55 that I flew for a very short while and the 60. The 55 loved the ground. Kinda like early Kosher Komets. I've pumped a 100 gallons of Prist :-) over the years.

I finished A&P school at the school across the street from LAX and had my choice of United, CAL and Western. All I had to do was walk in Monday morning. I went to CAL as more classmates went there. One of my friends went to Western ( The Only way to fly). 4 years later he was flying side saddle there as they actively hired from within. CAL did not so I had to leave to fly.

We had guys come back with books of Green Stamps! Some operators required the pilots to turn them into the CP upon return.

First airplane I ever "flew" was a DC-3 at 15. Still love round motors. Have 50 hrs RT seat In a PBY. My next door neighbor in HS flew P2s at Los Alamitos for the Navy.
 
You must remember United in the mid 1960's. They recruited college graduates with zero experience...no flight time at all.
So someone came up with:
United hired gentlemen and tried to turn them into pilots.
Western hired pilots and tried to turn them into gentlemen.
Both failed.
 
Good point that was long forgotten! :-) :-)
After having flown the last Low Frequency Range Approach in the USA when I was learning to fly (it was for rwnwy 15 at KBUR)(dee-dah, dee-dah, dah-dit, dah-dit) I still don't know how they did it back then day after day and didn't wind up in a smoking hole. Guess at ground speed, time from the Cone of Silence, let down into the unknown and still find the runway at night, in the rain trying to keep a steady tone in the headset?
I knew several Hump drivers and they did it on a single beacon with hand cranked DF antennas over the Himalayas. And now we have syn-vision and 15 foot EPE GPS available in SE spam cans? WOW!
 
My dad told me about the Low Freq nav stuff...doing it in T-6's.
No thanks.
I didn't like NDB approaches either.

Did participate in a no-gyro approach into Montreal...in the Connie. (1974)
Luckily the MOT didn't come by to have a few words with us or we'd still be grounded. We were supposed to be a "Day Time VFR" operation only. Landed at ILS approach minimums...(200 and 1/2 with heavy rain). No problem we were not ILS equipped. Nor did we have any instrument approach charts. In fact my 10 year old WAC chart was all we had on board.
 
weeds said:
My dad told me about the Low Freq nav stuff...doing it in T-6's.
No thanks.
I didn't like NDB approaches either.

Did participate in a no-gyro approach into Montreal...in the Connie. (1974)
Luckily the MOT didn't come by to have a few words with us or we'd still be grounded. We were supposed to be a "Day Time VFR" operation only. Landed at ILS approach minimums...(200 and 1/2 with heavy rain). No problem we were not ILS equipped. Nor did we have any instrument approach charts. In fact my 10 year old WAC chart was all we had on board.
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You must’ve been very young to be so bold 😉🙂
 
You're being kind.
I believe the words are "so stupid".

After college in Dec. 1972 I was playing the "catch-up" game. Had 2 1/2 years to build experience before turning 30.
It is safe to say I would have flown anything anywhere.
Nobody was hiring pilots for larger airplanes except some Beech 99 outfit in Missouri ($400/mth)....and a 4 engine firebombing/cropdusting company in Mesa. Chose to stay in state...didn't stick around long enough to check out as captain for obvious reasons.
 
Many folks today don't realize that back then when we turned 30 all the doors and options were closed at the majors as we were deemed "TOO OLD" to be hired as pilots.
 
Was just referring to something my old flight instructor used to tell me “there are old pilots and bold pilots, but no old bold pilots”
 
What's considered bold today was common place 70 or more years ago!
No Gyro approaches (they are still available today)
NDB approaches with a fixed card and/or a manually turned antenna.
Low Frequency Radio Range approaches in bad weather at night
Dead Reckoning let downs in the Himalayas flying the Hump
Go back to WWI and you see flying up through clouds with virtually no instruments (using the compass and airspeed only), flying in weather where the ceiling was less than 100' and 400 yards and fighting your adversary, cruising at 20,000' for 2 hours with no oxygen in an open cockpit biplane.
Flying Lighted Airways at night in the snow delivering the mail.
Going across the country on Colored Airways (who knows what Colored Airways are?)

Today we call these things crazy.
I might even consider circling approaches at night a bold maneuver today!
 
Cliff said:
What's considered bold today was common place 70 or more years ago!
No Gyro approaches (they are still available today)
NDB approaches with a fixed card and/or a manually turned antenna.
Low Frequency Radio Range approaches in bad weather at night
Dead Reckoning let downs in the Himalayas flying the Hump
Go back to WWI and you see flying up through clouds with virtually no instruments (using the compass and airspeed only), flying in weather where the ceiling was less than 100' and 400 yards and fighting your adversary, cruising at 20,000' for 2 hours with no oxygen in an open cockpit biplane.
Flying Lighted Airways at night in the snow delivering the mail.
Going across the country on Colored Airways (who knows what Colored Airways are?)

Today we call these things crazy.
I might even consider circling approaches at night a bold maneuver today!
Click to expand...
A quick Google search showed that 700 planes were lost and 1200 pilots died in the three years of flying the hump. The average age of a World War I pilot was under 24 and had a life expectancy of two weeks. Early airmail pilots had a life expectancy of about 900 flying hours, I sure am glad I fly for fun and not because I have to.Don’t get me wrong I have nothing but total admiration for you guys.
 
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